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Question for Military & ex-military?
- Thread starter 100%GRIZ
- Start date
As a member of the US Air Force, one thing every member learns very early in their career is about the chain of command. No where in the chain of command is there permission for just any random person to consult military matters with the public. (No matter rank). There are Public Affairs personnel to handle all information to be released to the press or general public. I am sure AZGRIZFAN can shed more light on this subject as he is a Navy man...
CatGrad-UMGradStu
Well-known member
I left the Army as a Major and only had company level commands. The commander broke the chain of command and wrote a rambling letter indicating he'd become instable. He had to be relieved of his command and referred to counseling. Very similar to what McChrystal did a few years ago.
Harm
Well-known member
The diff btwn regular, service and spec ops "opinions" couldn't be more obvious. The majority who say he broke chain of command...blah blah blah are regular, leg cannon fodder, dogma jackasses... the "Get shit done and solve the problem" spec ops folks applaud the Skipper. What's not being said is he sent his concerns up the dogma, small minded, uncreative C.O.C. nothing happened to solve the problem bc they were too busy trying to cover their own asses and sustain their careers. Therefore, in the interest of upholding his sacred oath of taking care of his men and women, he did what he had to do. He should be applauded, his crew are the folks on the ground with the proper context of the situation, all one needs to do is look at their actions to determine whether or not the skipper did the right thing... good one on the skipper!
Harm said:
I agree with this. Easy decisions have become very difficult in the last few years...we've centralized decision making far too high up the chain of command...
IdaGriz01
Well-known member
And it's been that way for a long, long time ... especially when the politicians get involved. Way back when I had a day job, my group won a contract to develop technology for special ops. (Since we couldn't meet their most stringent needs, I could describe it ... but I won't.) Anyway, our contact point was a guy who had "been there, done that." He never shared his service, but a hint might be his mantra: "Food is fuel, water is life." (Maybe that will mean something to some of you.) He generally described a "third world" op he was on. Pretty sure it was in South America, but obviously we had no "need to know," other than how it might drive our development work. Anyway, their communications were patched all the way back to the Pentagon, where someone from the White House was also standing by. (No, I am not kidding.) My guy never told us exactly what the issue was. At the time, I guessed that they had to wait for an "asset" (undercover agent) or politically important individual to clear the area before they blew the crap out of it. As I recall (been awhile), they had to wait about six hours, during which time the strike force might have been detected. I got the impression that was partly why the guy opted out of field work, even though he was still incredibly fit.SoldierGriz said:
22 year naval officer here. I said it on another message board the day it happened.....he was going to lose his command and it was the right thing to do. As a commanding officer you don’t a) violate the chain of command, b) “leak” anything to get your way, c) announce to the rest of the world that a US aircraft carrier was out of commission and going offline because of a virus spreading throughout the ship.
He literally did nothing right in this scenario. And I’m sure he knew it. Either he’s stupid, or he was getting REALLY bad advice from his subordinates. Or both.
He literally did nothing right in this scenario. And I’m sure he knew it. Either he’s stupid, or he was getting REALLY bad advice from his subordinates. Or both.
Harm said:
Wrong. Of course the crew loved it. But he still made the wrong decision...for the reasons outlined in my post above this. 155 cases of the virus, among a crew of over 5,000. Not a single case required hospitalization, as you would expect in a group of 5,000+ relatively young, very fit service members. Seems like a massive overreaction on his part.
If I were in his shoes and I’d decided it was worth risking my career over, I STILL wouldn’t have done it the way he did because of reason (c). Honestly, that’s probably the most egregious thing about what he did. I’d have gone to my boss. Then to my boss’s boss. And so on....NEVER GOING PUBLIC. Eventually it would have gotten to Trump and you KNOW he wouldn’t be capable of keeping his mouth shut about it.... :lol:
Harm
Well-known member
...”Worth risking my career over.....” couldn’t have put it on display better... IOW... worried about ones own career and ass instead of those your entrusted to take care of...those kinds of O’s never made it in, or were quickly discovered and kicked out and back down to the regular slug ranks... He put the mission and men first, before himself.
More will come out on what the Skipper TRIED to do, before he was left with no other choice. Whatever happens to him, which will most likely be to sacrifice him bc of admiral, SECNAV etc...embarrassment, he made the right call.
More will come out on what the Skipper TRIED to do, before he was left with no other choice. Whatever happens to him, which will most likely be to sacrifice him bc of admiral, SECNAV etc...embarrassment, he made the right call.
Harm said:
Yep.
Far too many Courtney Massengales and not enough Sam Damons.
This Captain was a Sam Damon..
More will come out undoubtedly.
CatGrad-UMGradStu
Well-known member
AZGrizFan said:
Ensign, I assume, you nailed it! My brother-in-law in Oak Harbor (a retired Master Chief for what it's worth) referred to the commander as an idiot for letting them have the opportunity to enjoy the many benefits of Korea while deployed on sea duty and exposing the entire crew
to this virus. I wasn't aware of that act of brilliance that led to the spread onboard. There's always a lot more facts and data we on the outside aren't aware of in these media driven misinformation snipits.
indian-outlaw
Well-known member
Oh BS... Once you are that high up in the chain of command there are politics involved. People stepping on each other to get another star. Sometimes people have to just do the right thing despite what some bureaucratic says. I applaud the guy for doing the right thing.AZGrizFan said:
I was a corporal in the Marines back in the day and as an infantry squad leader the chain of command was quite black and white but it is not at the admiral/general level.
Harm said:
He’s not “entrusted to take care of anyone”. He has one job. To ensure that ship is ready to fight. Not puss out because a couple of guys got sick. You’re the type of guy who wouldn’t shut the watertight door with guys inside if the compartment was flooding, and risk losing the whole ship, right? Because you didn’t want to lose any of those guys you’re “entrusted to take care of”? :roll:
He had 155 otherwise healthy 20-somethings who got sick. BFD. Keep the ship ready to fight. Adapt. Overcome. If this is what the military has come to we might as well pack up and fucking go home, honestly.
