Kaimin video, recruiting by UM and MSU

The more I read here and elsewhere, the more I see a "floundering" university and it has been going on since Engstrom's ascendancy to Main Hall. Crady seems to me, to be the kind of knowledgeable and forward thinking that is needed there. Instead, he is let go with glowing praise. There is a disconnect. After all, the new president came to UM from GE and it is beyond floundering. But, I digress.
Maybe, it is time for Montana to go private and rebuild the reputation that seems to have been lost. Hey, it worked for Pennsylania. Nothing else seems to be working.

first11 said:

NorthEndZoneDan said:

SoldierGriz said:

Anyone currently involved in UM recruitment should immediately be fired. Period.

This is a good swamp for Bodnar to drain. Start from scratch.

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UM had a nation wide search and hired Tom Crady. He was hired in the fall of 2016, barely 18 months ago. One of the first things to happen when he arrived was his budget was cut, a huge cut. Dollars and staff. He should be given dollars and staff and resources. If he can't produce, then I agree, he should be fired. Hiring a new guy after a national search, and then cutting his budget and staff and then showing him the door is not effective.

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Couldn’t agree more. The resources available to Crady are not sufficient. Good luck, hope our new president has a good plan. The old drain the swamp think is a simplistic long term approach.

Click to expand...

Resources are obviously an issue given the disparity between UM and msu. But, adding money and staff is not the silver bullet. In fact, those choices represent a simplistic, transactional, short-term, approach.

SB is initiating a transformational approach by reorganizing the staff in order to correctly align resources available to priorities. This will undoubtedly require the elimination of some positions. My guess is we will see more and not less of this, and it is required IMO.

I've been a UM fan my entire life, but did not go to college. I chose to take the trade route in the US Air Force. Worked out great. If I had to go back and decide what school to attend, it would be MSU. Much better choices than a liberal arts school. Many people will disagree with me, but it's how I see it.

This shit is soooo god damn easy to do in 2018...you can have a freaking robot send this shit out...and WE WERNT DOING IT??????

This blows my fucking mind.

It would have taken great resolve to not punch everyone involved in that department if i were Bodnar, lol.

Received my email from MAJ Bodnar. Very personal:"Dear Campus Community:" Anyway, reconfiguring the vice president for admissions and financial aid position is to be commended!

I would encourage those of you with more than a few connections to help this school steal a large portion of Rocky's financial aid office. It is something when a parent can write a smaller check for tuition and housing for a student attending Rocky than a student attending the U of M. Very large disconnect for some reason here.

Why would the state not help one of its major universities out with some additional funding?

SoldierGriz said:

NorthEndZoneDan said:

SoldierGriz said:

Anyone currently involved in UM recruitment should immediately be fired. Period.

This is a good swamp for Bodnar to drain. Start from scratch.

Click to expand...

UM had a nation wide search and hired Tom Crady. He was hired in the fall of 2016, barely 18 months ago. One of the first things to happen when he arrived was his budget was cut, a huge cut. Dollars and staff. He should be given dollars and staff and resources. If he can't produce, then I agree, he should be fired. Hiring a new guy after a national search, and then cutting his budget and staff and then showing him the door is not effective.

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Bondar is unleashed. This won't be the only boat he rocks. I will watch it unfold and admire from afar.

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regardless of whether it is really good for um... what a gem.

SoldierGriz said:

first11 said:

NorthEndZoneDan said:

SoldierGriz said:

Anyone currently involved in UM recruitment should immediately be fired. Period.

This is a good swamp for Bodnar to drain. Start from scratch.

Click to expand...

UM had a nation wide search and hired Tom Crady. He was hired in the fall of 2016, barely 18 months ago. One of the first things to happen when he arrived was his budget was cut, a huge cut. Dollars and staff. He should be given dollars and staff and resources. If he can't produce, then I agree, he should be fired. Hiring a new guy after a national search, and then cutting his budget and staff and then showing him the door is not effective.

Click to expand...

Couldn’t agree more. The resources available to Crady are not sufficient. Good luck, hope our new president has a good plan. The old drain the swamp think is a simplistic long term approach.

Click to expand...

Resources are obviously an issue given the disparity between UM and msu. But, adding money and staff is not the silver bullet. In fact, those choices represent a simplistic, transactional, short-term, approach.

SB is initiating a transformational approach by reorganizing the staff in order to correctly align resources available to priorities. This will undoubtedly require the elimination of some positions. My guess is we will see more and not less of this, and it is required IMO.

Click to expand...

so what facts are you working with to make these profound statements(bqm) sounds to me like you read a couple lines and then are 'intuiting' a bunch of conclusions based on... nothing but your gut feeling. got any facts to back up that what you say fits this situation(bqm)

argh! said:

SoldierGriz said:

first11 said:

NorthEndZoneDan said:

UM had a nation wide search and hired Tom Crady. He was hired in the fall of 2016, barely 18 months ago. One of the first things to happen when he arrived was his budget was cut, a huge cut. Dollars and staff. He should be given dollars and staff and resources. If he can't produce, then I agree, he should be fired. Hiring a new guy after a national search, and then cutting his budget and staff and then showing him the door is not effective.

Click to expand...

Couldn’t agree more. The resources available to Crady are not sufficient. Good luck, hope our new president has a good plan. The old drain the swamp think is a simplistic long term approach.

Click to expand...

Resources are obviously an issue given the disparity between UM and msu. But, adding money and staff is not the silver bullet. In fact, those choices represent a simplistic, transactional, short-term, approach.

SB is initiating a transformational approach by reorganizing the staff in order to correctly align resources available to priorities. This will undoubtedly require the elimination of some positions. My guess is we will see more and not less of this, and it is required IMO.

Click to expand...

so what facts are you working with to make these profound statements(bqm) sounds to me like you read a couple lines and then are 'intuiting' a bunch of conclusions based on... nothing but your gut feeling. got any facts to back up that what you say fits this situation(bqm)

Click to expand...

I would be interested to know when the Kaimin staff did this whole thing, because if it was anytime under the old VP, which it seems it was, the guy should have been fired long ago....people on here talking liek he was sooo good for the school...a breath of fresh air, a recruiting visionary????

BULL SHIT!!! This guy wasnt just not getting the job done...he was on the level of incompetence.

Does everyone on this forum understand how fucking easy it is to set up a program that automatically sends out emails????

bgbigdog said:

So the difference is the direct marketing firm, or not having the one that state ag employs? (By the way, love “tractor tech”, nicely played). You’re absolutely correct, there are non-compete clauses written into contracts as a matter of course. Money makes a great deal of difference, as does the firm.

But what I think you’re hearing Bodnar say is that the University is trying to figure out what it wants to be, now that it’s grown up. Tough to market something when you’re trying to figure out what you’re about. The university is struggling to be a relevant option for potential students given the world that awaits them. Bodnar knows that for sure.

That said, the kid @ the Kaimin laid it out pretty clearly. Everyone involved should be really embarrassed. Social media posts and email should be second nature, even for the most rudimentary of business partners. This was incredibly poorly executed, & 18 months is more than enough time to find a quality direct marketing partner & put together a significantly better effort.

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Yep. All that tells me is the national search failed.

AZGrizFan said:

bgbigdog said:

So the difference is the direct marketing firm, or not having the one that state ag employs? (By the way, love “tractor tech”, nicely played). You’re absolutely correct, there are non-compete clauses written into contracts as a matter of course. Money makes a great deal of difference, as does the firm.

But what I think you’re hearing Bodnar say is that the University is trying to figure out what it wants to be, now that it’s grown up. Tough to market something when you’re trying to figure out what you’re about. The university is struggling to be a relevant option for potential students given the world that awaits them. Bodnar knows that for sure.

That said, the kid @ the Kaimin laid it out pretty clearly. Everyone involved should be really embarrassed. Social media posts and email should be second nature, even for the most rudimentary of business partners. This was incredibly poorly executed, & 18 months is more than enough time to find a quality direct marketing partner & put together a significantly better effort.

Click to expand...

Yep. All that tells me is the national search failed.

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I agree completely....Day 1...set up a program to fucking send back emails to prospective students.....this is so so so easy!

argh! said:

SoldierGriz said:

first11 said:

NorthEndZoneDan said:

UM had a nation wide search and hired Tom Crady. He was hired in the fall of 2016, barely 18 months ago. One of the first things to happen when he arrived was his budget was cut, a huge cut. Dollars and staff. He should be given dollars and staff and resources. If he can't produce, then I agree, he should be fired. Hiring a new guy after a national search, and then cutting his budget and staff and then showing him the door is not effective.

Click to expand...

Couldn’t agree more. The resources available to Crady are not sufficient. Good luck, hope our new president has a good plan. The old drain the swamp think is a simplistic long term approach.

Click to expand...

Resources are obviously an issue given the disparity between UM and msu. But, adding money and staff is not the silver bullet. In fact, those choices represent a simplistic, transactional, short-term, approach.

SB is initiating a transformational approach by reorganizing the staff in order to correctly align resources available to priorities. This will undoubtedly require the elimination of some positions. My guess is we will see more and not less of this, and it is required IMO.

Click to expand...

so what facts are you working with to make these profound statements(bqm) sounds to me like you read a couple lines and then are 'intuiting' a bunch of conclusions based on... nothing but your gut feeling. got any facts to back up that what you say fits this situation(bqm)

Click to expand...

If $2.1 million gets you 8-10 mailers and a barrage of emails and social media while $1.4 million gets you one horrendously late little flyer with a dearth of information, I'm not sure an additional $2 million would solve UM's problems. It ain't about the money....I'd LOVE to see where the $1.4 million is ACTUALLY going, because it sure as hell isn't going to actual recruiting. Looks to me like the recruiting office at UM operates about like Wounded Warriors Project....95% of the money is spent to maintain the administrative staff and about 5% is spent on ACTUAL recruiting.

AZGrizFan said:

argh! said:

SoldierGriz said:

first11 said:

Couldn’t agree more. The resources available to Crady are not sufficient. Good luck, hope our new president has a good plan. The old drain the swamp think is a simplistic long term approach.

Click to expand...

Resources are obviously an issue given the disparity between UM and msu. But, adding money and staff is not the silver bullet. In fact, those choices represent a simplistic, transactional, short-term, approach.

SB is initiating a transformational approach by reorganizing the staff in order to correctly align resources available to priorities. This will undoubtedly require the elimination of some positions. My guess is we will see more and not less of this, and it is required IMO.

Click to expand...

so what facts are you working with to make these profound statements(bqm) sounds to me like you read a couple lines and then are 'intuiting' a bunch of conclusions based on... nothing but your gut feeling. got any facts to back up that what you say fits this situation(bqm)

Click to expand...

If $2.1 million gets you 8-10 mailers and a barrage of emails and social media while $1.4 million gets you one horrendously late little flyer with a dearth of information, I'm not sure an additional $2 million would solve UM's problems. It ain't about the money....I'd LOVE to see where the $1.4 million is ACTUALLY going, because it sure as hell isn't going to actual recruiting. Looks to me like the recruiting office at UM operates about like Wounded Warriors Project....95% of the money is spent to maintain the administrative staff and about 5% is spent on ACTUAL recruiting.

Click to expand...

Its systemic....based off this quote from the Missoulian article....its pretty obvious that the incompetence is found at every level within this school.

Faculty Senate Chair Bowman said her head was spinning with the news Crady's contract was not renewed, especially given recent reports of the budget cut that took place in enrollment and the uptick in freshman numbers nonetheless.



Really..your head is spinning??? He was innovative??? Sending emails has been around for quite some time, and we failed miserably to even do that.

Its literally never been easier to reach a wide range of people in the history of mankind....every day some moron with a twitter account becomes a millionaire because they can figure out how to monetize social media....but our guy we came up with from a national search cant figure out the very basics????

if i were a university president, the first two things i'd try to do would be to get rid of tenure, and enforce some kind of mandatory retirement age. way too many faculty have tenure as a goal, then when they get it, they kick back and do the bare minimum. that stops new people, ambitious people coming in, is a drag on the students (bored faculty suck as teachers), and also stops cross-pollination between university professors (they stay at one university because that is where they are 'safest').

then i'd scour colleges and departments to uncover all the appointments made because of cronyism and nepotism - both are rampant at universities. i'd also take a look at the cv's of professors - some of them seem impressive on the surface, but scratch that surface, and you'll often find gross exaggeration and blatant fraud. you know, like bodnar's, only to a much greater extent. as an example, a colleague recently was named dean of a college where i worked. this person has front and center on their cv a 'keynote speaker' talk at an important sounding conference in europe. but wait. a 15 second internet search shows that the company that put on the conference has been labeled a fraud. they just run these little 'conferences' at cool places like rome, and then cast a very wide net to get people to pay their own way (i.e. the university pays) for them to go spend 15 minutes giving a stock talk, slap something impressive sounding on their cv, then spend a week of paid vacation. as for cronyism, an example would be this college's previous deans' spouse - who was obviously the #2 in charge, got tons of university money for stuff he wasn't qualified to do, and scared away good applicants (who the hell wants to be the department chair of a department with the dean's spouse in it(bqm)

i could go on and on and on. academia is a bastion for frauds, because unlike in the commercial world, what one produces doesn't have to have real value beyond sounding good.

BadlandsGrizFan said:

AZGrizFan said:

argh! said:

SoldierGriz said:

Resources are obviously an issue given the disparity between UM and msu. But, adding money and staff is not the silver bullet. In fact, those choices represent a simplistic, transactional, short-term, approach.

SB is initiating a transformational approach by reorganizing the staff in order to correctly align resources available to priorities. This will undoubtedly require the elimination of some positions. My guess is we will see more and not less of this, and it is required IMO.

Click to expand...

so what facts are you working with to make these profound statements(bqm) sounds to me like you read a couple lines and then are 'intuiting' a bunch of conclusions based on... nothing but your gut feeling. got any facts to back up that what you say fits this situation(bqm)

Click to expand...

If $2.1 million gets you 8-10 mailers and a barrage of emails and social media while $1.4 million gets you one horrendously late little flyer with a dearth of information, I'm not sure an additional $2 million would solve UM's problems. It ain't about the money....I'd LOVE to see where the $1.4 million is ACTUALLY going, because it sure as hell isn't going to actual recruiting. Looks to me like the recruiting office at UM operates about like Wounded Warriors Project....95% of the money is spent to maintain the administrative staff and about 5% is spent on ACTUAL recruiting.

Click to expand...

Its systemic....based off this quote from the Missoulian article....its pretty obvious that the incompetence is found at every level within this school.

Faculty Senate Chair Bowman said her head was spinning with the news Crady's contract was not renewed, especially given recent reports of the budget cut that took place in enrollment and the uptick in freshman numbers nonetheless.



Really..your head is spinning??? He was innovative??? Sending emails has been around for quite some time, and we failed miserably to even do that.

Its literally never been easier to reach a wide range of people in the history of mankind....every day some moron with a twitter account becomes a millionaire because they can figure out how to monetize social media....but our guy we came up with from a national search cant figure out the very basics????

Click to expand...

dude, you are taking one kernel of information and conflating. that might make you feel good, but doesn't mean you actually know the whole situation.

argh! said:

SoldierGriz said:

first11 said:

NorthEndZoneDan said:

UM had a nation wide search and hired Tom Crady. He was hired in the fall of 2016, barely 18 months ago. One of the first things to happen when he arrived was his budget was cut, a huge cut. Dollars and staff. He should be given dollars and staff and resources. If he can't produce, then I agree, he should be fired. Hiring a new guy after a national search, and then cutting his budget and staff and then showing him the door is not effective.

Click to expand...

Couldn’t agree more. The resources available to Crady are not sufficient. Good luck, hope our new president has a good plan. The old drain the swamp think is a simplistic long term approach.

Click to expand...

Resources are obviously an issue given the disparity between UM and msu. But, adding money and staff is not the silver bullet. In fact, those choices represent a simplistic, transactional, short-term, approach.

SB is initiating a transformational approach by reorganizing the staff in order to correctly align resources available to priorities. This will undoubtedly require the elimination of some positions. My guess is we will see more and not less of this, and it is required IMO.

Click to expand...

so what facts are you working with to make these profound statements(bqm) sounds to me like you read a couple lines and then are 'intuiting' a bunch of conclusions based on... nothing but your gut feeling. got any facts to back up that what you say fits this situation(bqm)

Click to expand...

Here is a fact: keyboards are cheap. Get one.

SoldierGriz said:

argh! said:

SoldierGriz said:

first11 said:

Couldn’t agree more. The resources available to Crady are not sufficient. Good luck, hope our new president has a good plan. The old drain the swamp think is a simplistic long term approach.

Click to expand...

Resources are obviously an issue given the disparity between UM and msu. But, adding money and staff is not the silver bullet. In fact, those choices represent a simplistic, transactional, short-term, approach.

SB is initiating a transformational approach by reorganizing the staff in order to correctly align resources available to priorities. This will undoubtedly require the elimination of some positions. My guess is we will see more and not less of this, and it is required IMO.

Click to expand...

so what facts are you working with to make these profound statements(bqm) sounds to me like you read a couple lines and then are 'intuiting' a bunch of conclusions based on... nothing but your gut feeling. got any facts to back up that what you say fits this situation(bqm)

Click to expand...

Here is a fact: keyboards are cheap. Get one.

Click to expand...

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :clap: :clap: :clap:

Regardless of our opinions on how we perceive the facts it’s gonna be very problematic to attract the walk on water candidate for admissions VP given salary compensation and recent history

My son is a junior in high school this year and is looking at several colleges. He has been receiving lots of brochures and letters from numerous colleges, including MSU, NDSU, Carroll, Concordia, Pacific Lutheran, and many others. He has not received a SINGLE thing from U of M. It is interesting to see how receiving something from a college gets him excited. He immediately goes on-line and researches the college to see what they offer. He is a true Griz fan and is quite disappointed that he hasn't received anything from them. At this point, I would say that U of M is very low on his list of colleges because of it. Both his mom and I are U of M alum and to say that we are disappointed that he has not received ANYTHING from them is an understatement.

Yukon said:

I've been a UM fan my entire life, but did not go to college. I chose to take the trade route in the US Air Force. Worked out great. If I had to go back and decide what school to attend, it would be MSU. Much better choices than a liberal arts school. Many people will disagree with me, but it's how I see it.

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They are both 'liberal arts' schools. MSU's enrollment increases have been almost entirely in what one would call 'liberal arts'. They also have an engineering program which is why people wrongly categorize MSU as hard science STEM focused and UM as not. UM has better STM (Science Technology and Math) programs and faculty then MSU. They have better researchers, the top wildlife biology program in the world, their biological sciences graduate's acceptance rate into med school is twice the national average. They have a great pharmacy program, a business school and law school none of which MSU has. These programs directly lead good paying jobs, with real world applications.

The idea that UM doesn't teach technical or applied skills for real world jobs and MSU does is BS (Bachelor of Shit). They do all that and give you a 'liberal arts' education - which means they teach you to learn, write and think critically. This isn't a school filled with just philosophy majors and arts students (though they have those too and nothing wrong with that). What they have not had is an administration who knows how to market the school and battle these misconceptions! That is the difference between UM and MSU.